The argument you’re using there amounts to “we should do the wrong thing because it’s easier”. Forgive me if I find it less than compelling.
wrong? I don’t buy into that the only tech we should use is open source.
I’m typing this right now on a PC with Windows 10 on a Chrome browser over a network running on CISCO routers.
To have a full open source stack for most, and by most i mean something like 99.9% of the public, would be unrealistic.
You can support Open Source while using proprietary technologies.
Did I miss it in the policy that we should only use Open Source software?
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That’s the same argument for using Facebook. Ironic, really.
I don’t know if I’m missing something obvious, I’m pretty new to Matrix but hasn’t this work already been done as per
I tried logging in and joining #pirateirc_#PPAU:diasp.in room which let me join #PPAU IRC channel.
What stops the party from announcing IRC account creation freeze in lets say 3 months, then asking all the regulars and party members to move to Matrix with IRC being a deprecated legacy option and then maybe a year down the road once most people have migrated decommissioning IRC and turning on E2E encryption?
Is this not an option?
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On the front page it states that the Pirate Party is a movement based around civil and digital liberties, privacy and anonymity, and transparency. Using a proprietary service for party communications that’s based in the USA and that has already had at least one user data breach, when there are other, better options available, runs clearly counter to those principles.
(Also the programmer in me takes one look at Electron being used and struggles not to vomit. But that’s a different issue.)
If someone suggested moving all communications to Facebook I expect there’d be even more controversy. As far as I can tell having a presence there is more of an advertising necessity, and feeding the giant privacy-violating behemoth beyond that purpose is probably not something we should be doing.
Sorry must have misunderstood there. it looked like you were using FB for organising stuff (which a lot of people do by default because “it’s easier”). Basically allergic to FB and self-exclude from many things due to people requiring its use to be involved in any organisational capacity, so it’s something I pay attention to before considering joining any organisation or group. Generally bcos I will have to say sorry, can’t do xyz if you need me to do it on FB. Kinda like Chuck in Better Call Saul. So, good to know.
Keep in mind that I’m not actually a member yet either. At this point almost entirely because I haven’t gotten around to reading the party constitution. So I could very well be slightly off base, but to the best of my knowledge the organisational tools used are more etherpad, wiki, email, irc, and this forum.
I permanently deactivated my FB account around the beginning of this year. Not deleted, because I don’t like the idea of retroactively removing one half of a conversation.
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I disagree with your interpretation. You’re just assuming an organisational policy interpretation when it really is not clear at all.
“Better” is subjective. What can definitely be objectively measured is the lack of engagement and communication of the party, as well as the uptick in messages per user and install speed in both time and clicks to get a slack server and individual clients running. Your argument lacks validity.
Free =/= Freedom
Freedom =/= Free
Expecting us to require all our resources to be absolutely free as far as expenses are concerned to fit in with what we want to represent/support can be a little unrealistic at times. As long as it meets the following conditions, I’m OK with whatever.
Freedom to adapt it to suit our needs
Agreeable licencing terms
Portable between OSs
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“Open is more transparent than proprietary.”
“Federated protocols support civil/digital liberties more than centralised.”
“All services hosted by third parties in the USA are less private than ones on hosting you control.”
These are the sorts of statements you’re disagreeing with. Apparently we’re speaking different languages here. I remain incredibly unimpressed with the latest fashionable app you’re pushing and I’m not really interested in arguing further.
I’m not pushing the app. I gave up on that about a year ago.
The issue is the decision making and strategy of the party which does seem influenced by a very narrow focus.
That certainly looks to be a great option with minimal effort, I’d like to look into this with some more detail.
Kudos, there are valid concerns there that are still not addressed.
There’s always options. However nothing is going to change unless someone puts forward an actual proposal for the National Council to consider. We hold meetings once a fortnight on Wednesdays (there’s one tonight), but thus far no Party member has put forward a proposal that can be actioned (no this thread doesn’t count).
Where this discussion has come up before I’ve offered to work with members to help move things forward, that offer is still open.
Assume:
- We don’t have much money
- We don’t have armies of sysadmins
- Any proposal needs to be an ‘in house’ solution
Here is the beginning of an effort to develop a proposal the National Council could vote to adopt from months ago. It isn’t finished and needs major work before it would be acceptable, I’ve updated the todo at the top, feel free to contact me for help: https://pad.pirateparty.org.au/p/proposal-implement-matix-platform
We’re (unofficially) trying out Matrix for social chat. Not self-hosted yet and no IRC bridge either. Come and join us! I recommend using the Riot webchat client or their iOS/Android apps
https://matrix.to/#/#ppau-social:matrix.org
Update: the Indian Pirates have a bridge going to PirateIRC and we’re piggybacking it to #ppausocial and #ppau on IRC.
In general you can access any PirateIRC channel with https://matrix.to/#/#pirateirc_#channel-name:diasp.in
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Matrix looking good, and the price is right.
New threads are free 
It seems I can’t reply to this thread as a linked thread; doing that certainly would’ve been more appropriate.